Affordable Care Act Upheld! - Page 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by StockJock-e 

The difference with car insurance is that you can choose to drive uninsured, you cant take that risk. If you crash your car.. your loss, too bad.

 

You can also choose to not carry health insurance, but if you break your arm and get rushed to the ER, they will not leave you sitting there with your bone exposed, they will treat you and if you have no money, the hospital will eat the costs... They then pass on the higher prices to everybody else.

 

If you crashed your car, your mechanic will not fix it for free and then pass on the costs to his other customers.

There are way to make cases when person denied in treatment due to lack of insurance.  

Quote:

Originally Posted by Venom08 

Doctors always overcharge by about 100-150% so that they make some money. IMO, doctors are underpaid and they should be making 2-3x what they're currently making. Also, Obamacare will put millions onto Medicaid and Medicaid pays close to nothing. Many doctors don't even accept Medicaid so those millions of new Medicaid recipients probably won't get any care whatsoever.

I have a freind that is a doctor, and he is making a killing off patients that are pregnant and have no insurance ( OBGYN )....he is doing some medicaid patients, but had problems with them in the past.Threatening him with all kinds of BS like bringing him up in front of the medical board, etc. Almost lost his practice over some miss filed paperwork. And they wonder why no doctors want anything to do with medicaid.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/06/28/Did-Roberts-Give-in-to-Obama-Bullying

This is what I think happened. After the hearings in April I'm sure that Kagan told Obama that it was 5-4 to turn over the entire law and since then Obama has been attacking Roberts into voting for it. Obama looked really pissed and scared after giving the speech where he attacked the Supreme Court and he knew that the rule would not go in his favor. Also, apparently Justice Roberts takes epilepsy medication and they have strange side effects. People that have read his statement on the ruling say that Robert's writings on his justification made no sense/ were incoherent.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/06/28/michael_savage_roberts_epilepsy_medication_effects_his_cognition.html

Michael Savage is probably the smartest man in America. He's been right about so many things so many times I cannot even count them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoJobRob 

People should have health insurance. If there is any culprit here it's the health insurance agencies.

not to start an argument but......contradiction here ain't it?

I agree that anyone under the age of 18 should be covered. The rest of us shouldn't be strong armed into paying for something we don't need.

I've been without coverage since 1989....think of how much money I saved.

Insurance is nothing more than legalized gambling anyway:

They are gambling nothing bad will happen to you.

You are gambling something bad will happen to you.

In Las Vegas, the odds are, the "house" always wins. In this case, the insurance companies are the "house".

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/scalia-kennedy-thomas-and-alito-dissent-we-cannot-rewrite-statute-be-what-it-not_647952.html

Exactly, the 5 who voted for Obamacare changed the language of the law because they allow it to be constitutional since they consider it a tax. But it does not say 'tax' anywhere in the law.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Venom08 

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/scalia-kennedy-thomas-and-alito-dissent-we-cannot-rewrite-statute-be-what-it-not_647952.html

 

Exactly, the 5 who voted for Obamacare changed the language of the law because they allow it to be constitutional since they consider it a tax. But it does not say 'tax' anywhere in the law.

We need to repeal the 16th amendment...they're getting out of control here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoJobRob 

I personally have no problem with the law. People should have health insurance.

I have to disagree Rob. I think everyone is entitled to health care but not to insurance. Premiums are going way up and why do I have to pay for someones insurance? I'll pay for their reduced medical costs (oldfart cited his savings) but I damn sure don't want to pay for their premiums.

In my opinion, the legislature could have written or changed a few laws and fixed the problems. Pelosi said you have to pass it to understand it. Bullshit! Fix tort reform, interstate commerce and a few other things and it's fixed. I think it will become more manageable in Jan.

Get the lawyers out of our healthcare system and we'll save trillions. On the bright side, Romney has raised over $2.5 million today. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldFart 

not to start an argument but......contradiction here ain't it?

 

I agree that anyone under the age of 18 should be covered. The rest of us shouldn't be strong armed into paying for something we don't need.

I've been without coverage since 1989....think of how much money I saved.

 

Insurance is nothing more than legalized gambling anyway:

They are gambling nothing bad will happen to you.

You are gambling something bad will happen to you.

 

In Las Vegas, the odds are, the "house" always wins. In this case, the insurance companies are the "house".

I guess I could have worded it better (I was on my Android and in a hurry). I think people should have health care. But yes, the insurance companies are shit. People are worried that the government will "ration care", but what do you think the insurance companies do? I mean, come on...  I had a situation last summer where I went to the ER and my insurance denied my claim, though my visit was through no fault of my own. I was pretty pissed. I actually told them over the phone that they were fired and that I was switching to their competitor. Obviously it had no effect, but it made me feel better. LOL I think they were a bit surprised to hear someone tell them they're fired. I mean, I held up MY end of the bargain by paying my monthly premiums, for them not to hold up their end means they have no integrity. Period. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobK 

 

I have to disagree Rob. I think everyone is entitled to health care but not to insurance. Premiums are going way up and why do I have to pay for someones insurance? I'll pay for their reduced medical costs (oldfart cited his savings) but I damn sure don't want to pay for their premiums.

 

In my opinion, the legislature could have written or changed a few laws and fixed the problems. Pelosi said you have to pass it to understand it. Bullshit! Fix tort reform, interstate commerce and a few other things and it's fixed. I think it will become more manageable in Jan.

Go ahead and celebrate!

You will learn soon enough it isn't the wonderful gift you think it is.

A Gift you pay through the nose for is NO GIFT.

http://www.city-journal.org/html/17_3_canadian_healthcare.html

Don, What will be your fate in another 10-20 years when you really need it?

If you amass any wealth you could afford to go to SouthEast Asia. 

They have the best Trendy, upscale clinics at present.

.

You make it seem like you need to be super rich for that. It's sadly cheaper to pay the 8.5k to fly first class to Thailand, and get treated in Thailand for a tumor than it is to have that tumor diagnosed in the US. While you're there you can enjoy all the wonderful food there for lunch for about 3.50 USD. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Techunter 

If you amass any wealth you could afford to go to SouthEast Asia. 

They have the best Trendy, upscale clinics at present.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoJobRob 

 

I guess I could have worded it better (I was on my Android and in a hurry). I think people should have health care. But yes, the insurance companies are shit. People are worried that the government will "ration care", but what do you think the insurance companies do? I mean, come on...  I had a situation last summer where I went to the ER and my insurance denied my claim, though my visit was through no fault of my own. I was pretty pissed. I actually told them over the phone that they were fired and that I was switching to their competitor. Obviously it had no effect, but it made me feel better. LOL I think they were a bit surprised to hear someone tell them they're fired. I mean, I held up MY end of the bargain by paying my monthly premiums, for them not to hold up their end means they have no integrity. Period. 

 

That's why it should not be a law that you cannot sue your HMO ( I think they've changed that ). My wife lost about 20% of her hearing due to insurance telling here she didn't need a certain test. The ear infection got worse, and she lost some of her hearing thanks to those cheap bastards. At the time, we could not sue her HMO for negligence.

Another reason this "tax" is BS is that they are taxing us on something that never happened.

Because I didn't purchase something, I am being "taxed" on it.....wtf kind of logic is that?????

No money exchanged hands, so they can tax me on a non-existant transaction?

They've gone too far, and any lawyer worth a penny knows this. Unfortunately, our Supreme courts have already "decided" our fate.

60 Minutes, I think they were the TV show, did a piece on costs compared to the U.S.

Kidney transplant U.S. - $55,000 to 100,000.

Malaysia - $16,000 - That included airfare, a fancy private suite and 6 weeks of recooping seaside at an Ocean resort afterwards.

That is with American University-Trained Doctors and the latest equipment.

Quote:

Originally Posted by WillTheGreat 

You make it seem like you need to be super rich for that. It's sadly cheaper to pay the 8.5k to fly first class to Thailand, and get treated in Thailand for a tumor than it is to have that tumor diagnosed in the US. While you're there you can enjoy all the wonderful food there for lunch for about 3.50 USD. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Techunter 

60 Minutes, I think they were the TV show, did a piece on costs compared to the U.S.

Kidney transplant U.S. - $55,000 to 100,000.

Malaysia - $16,000 - That included airfare, a fancy private suite and 6 weeks of recooping seaside at an Ocean resort afterwards.

That is with American University-Trained Doctors and the latest equipment.

 

How about comparing quality to price? There must be a reason that anyone with money comes to the US for treatment. You get what you pay for.

whats justice? because this being upheld is absolute bullshit.

The people who are cheering dont have a full grasp on what this means and impacts other attributes.

Quality of service exceeds anything offered in the United States. The facilities are state of the art in many hospitals in Southeast Asia and the doctors are highly trained in western medicine many of which are not native to the respective country. I know a radiologist that practices in Thailand, the limited regulations allow many doctors to practice to the full extent of their abilities. The problem with treatment is liability which is a double edge sword. Doctors go above and beyond to take proper precautions not necessarily to make sure you're getting the proper treatment but to cover their own ass, there are medications and operations that work quickly and generate greater results but unless you meet the serve prerequisites doctors in the States would not qualify you for those options for the sake of liability. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobK 

How about comparing quality to price? There must be a reason that anyone with money comes to the US for treatment. You get what you pay for.

As for mjoke's argument, he has a valid point. 

"Beginning in 2014, those who do not comply with the mandate must make a "shared responsibility payment" to the Federal Government...The Act provides that the penalty will be paid to the Internal Revenue Service with an individual's taxes, and 'shall be assessed and collected in the same manner'" - Pretty obvious what this indicates.

"In 2016, for example, the penalty will be 2.5 percent of an individual's household income, but no less than the $695 and no more than the average yearly premium for insurance that covers 60% of the cost of 10 specific services" 

The tax becomes essentially a fixed payment, it doesn't hurt you if you're naturally low income. This becomes a problem for your average middle class families, those right in between the 90-125k mark (between the couple). They will be the ones that are more than likely to not qualify for government subsidized Medicaid/Medicare. The same can be said about smaller businesses that are in the middle of the pact who has to provide coverage to employees. Private healthcare isn't cheap for those who can't don't qualify for government subsidized programs for those that still haven't figured it out.